Menifee City Council Meeting - May 5, 2009

The first part of the public meeting was a study session that started at 5:30pm. The study session was two parts, one involving land annexation for a housing development called "The Shores at Menifee", and the other involving a commercial development called, "Menifee Lakes Plaza".

The Shores at Menifee

This matter is more about the city annexing some extra land, than it is about the development itself. The development sits right on the border of Menifee and county land, as noted below...

the shores at menifee
The part that is in Menifee is the upper-left portion containing the three yellow parcels. The rest of it lies on county land. That's Briggs Road running north and south separating the two jurisdictions, and that's Salt Creek running through the middle, with Domenigoni Rd running east and west in the bottom.

The developer wants the City of Menifee to annex the county portion so that it'll be much easier for them to manage. As it stands now, they'd have to work with two different authorities, and two different plans, and two different bureacracies.

A representative of the developer stood before the council and gave a lengthy presentation on why the City should be totally excited about having this development 100% within its limits. He showed countless photos of how beautiful this thing is going to look. He also stressed the fact that right now, Menifee is really losing out because the City of Temecula has the more attractive market for housing.

However, IF the City of Menifee annexes this chunk of land, and approves this housing development, then Menifee will command the all the housing dollars that Temecula is getting right now. The developer did his best to really sell the council on this project.

He also said that because this development sits on Salt Creek, there will be green belts along both sides of Salt Creek, consisting of grass that could actually be used as park space.

John Denver responded right away that this proposed development must come with a really high HOA fee. The developer responded that it would not be anymore than Harveston, Heritage Lake, Menifee Lake, or Centex at the Lakes.

Wallace Edgerton asked if the home prices would be priced lower or higher than in competing developments. The developer said they would be priced around 17% lower than in similar lake developments.

Fred Twyman noted that the lot sizes are rather small, and the homes are pretty compact. In fact, these homes don't have streets, rather the developer used the word "alleys". Twyman went on to say that the areas on the borders of Menifee, such as this area, are typically where the 1 acre and multi-acre properties are, and that having such small cramped homes in this area is against the existing community make up.

The developer responded to Fred by saying that the existing economy, as bad it is right now, just won't support 1 acre lot sizes. He said that home builders won't even bother with it, and that the only way to sell homes these days is to build 'em small, and sell 'em cheap (he didn't actually use those words).

But the developer did use the words, "self-sustaning residential lifestyle community" to describe this place. In other words, it's going to have a shopping center, some restaurants, and a lake.

Scott Mann responded that he really liked the creation of green belts on both sides of Salt Creek, and that's he generally in support of this project. However, he was of the opinion that this presentation would discuss more about the annexation of land, and not so much the development.

Darcy Kuenzi seemed to say the same thing that Scott said, liking the green belts, and the project in general.

Note: because this was presented during a study session, the council did not make any decision on this.

My Opinion: We don't need anymore homes, we need more jobs! I recommend the council have the developer revise the plan so that the portion that's in Menifee become the shopping center, and leave the homes on county land.

And I don't understand this need to compete against Temecula. Why are we building a town for people who have yet to move here? City council members would do better to focus on those of us who are already here.
Menifee Lakes Plaza

This a shopping center on the corner of Newport Rd and Antelope Rd. It's the only empty space there is on that intersection.

The developer was simply giving a presentation on an issue that the city all too familiar with already. In that sense, he basically just flew through the details.

It'll be 16.29 acres total. 120,848 sq ft of retail space.

There will be hotel with 71 rooms, comprising of four stories. There will be a gas station with car wash, and convenience store, along with restaurants, but not certain if these are just fast-food, or what.

There will be traffic light built at Pampas & Palm Villa.

There will also be a 75 foot tall sign sitting by the I-215 freeway. This sign is apparently higher than what the law allows, however, the developer wants an exception to be made. It seems every commercial development has a sign that's taller than what law the allows, and the developer always wants an exception to be made. Makes you wonder why they have a law.

Menifee Lakes Plaza
Scott Mann asked if the developer conducted any community outreach, particularly since the hotel will be 4 stories, instead of the 3 stories that the law currently allows. The developer said they met with folks from the Palmia community, and that they were all very receptive to it, but I didn't quite hear what his definition of "receptive" was. He said they plan to meet with folks from Oasis on May 12.

Fred Twyman said his family loves to eat at restaurants with outdoor dining patios, and wondered if there would be any such restaurants here. The developer said that they have plans for restaurants to be there, but didn't go so far as to say what type, how big, or if they'll have outdoor patios.

Darcy Kuenzi said that she was concerned about the sign being "very visual". But she clarified that to say that she wants the sign, and the overall look of the development to have a very unique look. She described what drivers along the I-215 would see as they came from the north, coming over the hill, and down towards Newport Rd. She wanted this sign to cry out "Menifee", and not "Temecula". Perhaps she was referring to the "agrarian look" of Countryside Marketplace across the freeway.

It'll likely be June or July when the city council will be asked to make an tentative approval on the map.

Todd Friedman, a resident of Tierra Shores, spoke up with a public comment, asking about the traffic this would create. He noted the hotel would create more traffic, and that hotels typically attract crime. The council did not answer, with the Mayor explaining that they had run out of time on this study session, and that Fred Twyman had already expressed concerns about traffic also.

City Council Meeting

And then the actual city council meeting started at 7:10pm.

Public Comments

Terry Freeman, who lives in Tierra Shores, complained about the stench in that neighborhood. He said it's not coming from the Dairy, but from the RV Park. I presume he's talking about Wilderness Lake. He said they have their own sewage treatment plant, and that the smell comes from gases "burping" out of the treatment plant. He wants the city to get with the "water quality control board", to create more strict rules. He said the RV Park has made no changes to its sewage system since 1995. The Mayor deferred the matter to the City Planner, who promptly talked to Terry.

Chuck Ruetter, asked the city council to adopt rules that require home builders to install drought tolerant plants instead of lawns. Interestingly, I just got an announcement from Eastern Municipal Water District the other day that this Saturday, May 9, they will host a "Water-Wise Demonstration Garden Grand Opening" from 10 am to 2 pm at its Perris headquarters (2270 Trumble Road) to showcase water-efficient landscaping and irrigation methods.

I agree with Chuck, if the council is going to approve every new home development, they have to be responsible about the water implications, and force these builders to install drip irrigation, and xeriscaping.

Anne Weston, said that the county Planning Commission is going to hold a public hearing at the Eastern Municipal Water District office on May 13, 9:00am, regarding some zoning issues that may affect Procinctu, the private military training facility that's supposed to be going in just north of Menifee's boundaries. She also mentioned that the land where Procinctu is going drains into a watershed, and that lead bullets from the firing range will create lead poisoning in the water.

Abatement of Public Nuisances

This is a new ordinance the council approved at the last session, and is approving again for a second time. This time, Darcy Kuenzi asked the city attorney how this law could be enforced, eluding to some kind of vagueness in the wording.

The city attorney spoke up saying that this ordinance was created for a specific issue in a specific area of town, where off-road vehicles are making a lot of noise. This will give cops a means to bust those people, but that the law wasn't intended to be enforced regularly.

Planning Commission

The council adopted an ordinance that will create the Planning Commission. The Planning Commission will consist of city residents who will be referred to as "planning commissioners". Each city council member will be allowed to appoint one planning commissioner.

An argument discussion broke out over the process by which planning commissioners can be removed. Edgerton was of the opinion that they had agreed a commissioner could only be removed by the city council member who appointed him/her. The council members disagreed, that a planning commissioner could be removed by a 3-to-2 vote of the council members.

This apparently was a big bone of contention.

I'm not sure if there was anything to read in between the lines on this, but considering we have some city council members who are pro-development, and others who seem to scrutinize development, the potential removal of a planning commissioner could have political implications. And in fact, Edgerton stated that he did not want council members voting out a planning commissioner for political reasons.

The mayor wanted to know that the only way a planning commissioner could be voted out was for reasons of "cause". The other council members noted that this was a very difficult subject to define, and asked the city attorney to clarify. Edgerton ended up having a lengthy discussion with the attorney on what exactly "cause" could mean, and she explained that it's very unclear, and that it could create a legal nightmare for the city, should a planning commissioner decide to sue if removed for such reasons.

At one point, John Denver accused the Mayor of arguing with the city attorney.

This was probably one of the most heated debates between city council members I've seen, while everyone tried their best to keep their cool, and look professional. But the frustration was pretty well evident.

They finalized the discussion by saying that tomorrow, an application form will be on the City's website that folks can use to throw their name into the hat for consideration.

Curfew and Truancy

The city adopted an ordinance on curfews and truancy. The city had previously used the county's ordinance, and simply replaced it with their own, and it's actually the same law. Kids are supposed to be off the streets by 10:00pm.

Scott Mann asked if they should change this to 11:00pm instead, noting that his 17 year old son often drives to other schools because he's active in sports, and that many times gets back to town late, and needs to stop at a fast-food joint for some chow. There was some discussion on this, and I forget who said it, but one council member said that Scott's son wouldn't have a problem because he was such a good kid. I didn't necessarily see how that comment would help the other parents of this town.

Nonetheless, Scott shrugged it off and accepted the 10:00pm curfew.

The city attorney also chimed in and said that neighboring cities also have 10:00pm curfews, and that setting Menifee's curfew to 11:00pm would create some confusion.

City Manager's Report

The city manager presented the council with a proposal to create an ordinance against parking one's car on their front lawn. Apparently, they've been getting these complaints.

The council sounded in support of such an ordinance, but wanted some clarification on the definition of "front lawn" noting that some properties have a lots of acreage, and that parking one's car in front of the house could be construed as a "front lawn" if there wasn't enough definition to the ordinance.

Veterans Memorial

Scott Mann reported that progress is being made on the Veterans Memorial. They have designs in the works.

Also, he said if any veterans out there want to get involved in this, to contact him at his e-mail: smann@cityofmenifee.us




92 Comments:

  1. The developer "selling" his project along salt creek says that the HOA dues for his developement will be no more that Menifee lakes of Centex on the Lake??

    Centex is now at $185.00 per month while Menifee Lakes continues to be at only 45.00 per month.

    So which is it?

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  2. I agree with Steve. The City Council should concentrate less on building homes for people who have not moved here yet. There are plenty of homes available for sale in neighborhoods all over Menifee. If we are going to build anything, how about a Sports Park, another Middle School, or High School? The one thing I don't want to see is a massive build-out like Orange County. If the City Council is not careful, that's where we will be heading.

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  3. I agree with the NOTE part. We don't need more homes built,put those on county land and the shopping center in Menifee. I think this whole gang of councilmen and the mayor are so caught up in their own ego's that they don't care about us residents. Also, the hotel and fast food restuarants on Antelope are going to create so much more traffic. How can we deal with more traffic on Newport Road. People sit thru threee lights at times just to get to the 215 exit now. Lets make the developers improve the roads first before building any more stuff that we don't want or need.

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  4. Does the city council actually care? The seal should of gone to a vote at a council meeting that allowed residents to voice opinion to help the council make an informed choice and not operate in a vacum! Just like the planning commission. The council will appoint some lackey and not a real concerned citzen. Also, build infrastructure WE DON"T NEED MORE HOUSES. We need parks. when is valley wide going to offer more adult sports aside from softball? TEMCULA SUCKS, that is why I want to live in Menifee. lets keep our limited ID.

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  5. We have enough empty homes and empty construction sites already. We do not need anymore homes in Menifee yet. Get more shopping and employment in the city first so that the employees will have a place to live first.
    We've got a huge apartment complex going up and that small home with alleys concept is the same damn thing as apartments or condo's.
    We moved out here because of the lot sizes and design of the homes and neighborhoods.
    If we fill this city with small homes/apartments we are going to be just like any other city.

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  6. Let us concentrate on what we already have, and use our resources better on the existing roads, schools, and empty shopping centers, etc. We can not sell the empty houses that we have now. Why approve building more.

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  7. I live in Ashton Hills and would be very unhappy with a hotel at Antelope and Newport. I agree with the citizen that stated that hotels bring crime and lets be honest with ourselves, are we enough of a "tourist" attraction that we warrant a 4 story hotel/motel?? I'd like to see a gym and some more restaurants, perhaps a pharmacy, seems all the pharmacies are on the otherside of the 215. A hotel is a laughable idea.

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  8. We were supposed to get a Walgreen's at the corner of Antelope and Scott Rd. The unit is completely built and the windows are boarded up. I asked the other Walgreens at Murrieta/Newport and they informed me that due to the economic crisis the opening of this new Walgreen's has been put on hold.
    For how long though?

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  9. Love Terry Freeman's comments re: the stench from either the dairy farm or the Camp Ground. Something does need to be done because there are times when it is absolutely sickening. It is not just Tierra Shores that is affected... the revolting smell extends all the way into Menifee Lakes, Callie Kirkpatrick, South Shore Elementary etc. It is disgusting and needs to be addressed. There is no way that it is healthy for anyone to be breathing that in..

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  10. Supporting the smell issue, yes it does bother more communities than just T.S. The smell is not from cows, it is from Wilderness Lakes and their poor sewage treatment. If this smell bothers you, please get involved and contact the local government offices to do something about it. Some places to try are the County Environmental Health office and the agency that Terry referenced. You can make complaints on the Environmental Health Dept. website.

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  11. Thank you BigTony. I will DEFINITELY follow up with those agencies. FYI I sent two emails to City Hall months ago and got no reply at all.

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  12. In regards to Air quality near TS. A good place to start complaints is with AQMD (Air Quality Management Department) They dont mess around and they LOVE to hand out big whoppen fines. Here is a helpful link to start.
    http://www.aqmd.gov/complain/reporting_aq_problems.html

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  13. Considering the State is short on money, it seems logical the AQMD will levy fines.

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  14. I heard that Walgreens at Scott and Antelope will be opening in July. Walgreens wanted to hold on the opening but supposedly the owner of the shopping center threatned to sue. I heard this from 3 different sources but then again I heard from more that 6 or 7 sources that a fitness center was opening in Menifee and that never happened. We'll see. FYI ... I read that the Menifee Red Robin is the #1 money maker in the chain. Menifee can support a big chain restaurants. This should prove to BJ's and TGIF'S if they come, so will we.

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  15. The shopping center under construction at Scott and Antelope is not in Menifee. It and the existing one west of Antelope are both in Murrieta.

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  16. After seven meetings, Menifee's Blue Ribbon Committee on Governance Structure has recommended that citizens revote on how they elect the city's council members. (from PE)

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  17. Anyone get a "surprise" in thier recent water bill?

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  18. "Anyone get a "surprise" in thier recent water bill?"

    Was it a white powder?

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  19. The "surprise" was the amount of the bill, based on factors EMWD estimated.

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  20. MORE TRAFFIC ON NEWPORT AND THE 215? What are they thinking? It is amazing how we sell out our peace of mind, efficiency, and quality of life because some developer wants to make a million and live somewhere else. We do not need a 4 story hotel. That is excessive. It took me 15 minutes to get from Bradley to the Postal annex the other day. Inexcusable!
    As for Scott Mann's son, give me a break! These sports kids nor any others need to be "chowing" down that late on fast food. Stock the fridge with Hungry Man's and get these kids home where they need to be. No exceptions unless they are traveling home from work.
    How many people have to say, NO MORE HOMES for the councel to listen? Let's be conservative, make what we have better and not rush ahead until the economy and the flow of traffic is better.

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  21. All those against the hotel on Newport and Antelope, I urge you to contact our elected officials. I sent an e-mail to Mayor Edgerton and received a timely response. Council meetings are on the first and third tuesdays of the month. Let's voice our opinions. Also, it appears that a planning commission will be in charge of our "fate" so apply to be on it. The application is on the city's website. A hotel is BAD idea. Do we really want a criminal element fro neighboring towns taking up residence here? Because a hotel in a city without tourism may bring that fate. Even if the hotel is "upscale", if it fails to bring a steady flow of visitors it can turn trashy really quick. BAD IDEA!!! If you agree, tell our council-MAY 19!!!

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  22. If you agree, tell our council-MAY 19!!!

    I think the meeting has been moved to the 20th?

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  23. Yeah, Heaven forbid we build a nice hotel for our families and friends to stay at during the holidays, weddings or family events. Never should a tired highway traveler stay in Menifee, that would be awful, because undoubtedly they are trained assassins sent here to ruin our pristine community with just one nights stay.

    You guys are right, the last thing we need is a nice hotel and a nice restaurant next to it, if we had that then it would stop to globe from turning and every druggie and gangbanger would 'live' at the hotel. There would be old west style shootouts nightly and anyone would be able to go to the hotel and buy some crack or heroin from the hundreds of dealers who would 'live' at our new upscale hotel.

    Without doubt, don't build a nice hotel here, cause if we do it would only create more jobs for our local economy. The last thing we need in this town is more jobs.

    The other thing we don't need, that a new hotel would bring, is tax dollars to our new city. Studies have proved that new cities never need an increase in sales tax revenue, in fact an increase in sales tax revenue is sure to ruin any new city, so don't ever build anything - EVER.

    In conclusion, it is highly evident that the construction of a hotel, a restaurant and some shops would create a black hole of crime, filth and depravity that would cause the depletion of the ozone layer, the rupture of our collective faith in God and locusts would swarm our homes and kill us all within moments of the first person checking in to their hotel rooms on the night of the grand opening.

    Thank you for your time,

    Mrs. NIMBY

    (Yes folks, that is SARCASM - build the hotel already!)

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  24. And Mrs Sarcasm, where do you live? In the proposed neighborhood? Because I do. Do you think we would honestly fill up a whole hotel with families?? Right sure...I'm sure its families that are staying at that really nice motel in Sun City right? This isn't file of dreams, just because you build doesn't mean they'll come. And none of us are saying we don't want the tax dollars, but it is not a zero sum game: we can get tax dollars from more suitable projects. Looks like pro-development is planting comments on 247! Mrs Nimby...like that is your real name...If you want a hotel, move somewhere where it makes sense to have one. I moved to Menifee for the Family atmosphere. If I wanted a hotel in my neighborhood I would've moved next to Disneyland. And yes we can recognize sarcasm when we see it, we can also recognize blind ignorance too.

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  25. We can barely drive down Newport as it is. It takes numerous light changes to even cross Antelope. We also have quite a few vacant and foreclosed homes. Why on earth do we need more homes (which equals more traffic) here? Don't even get me started on a hotel. Thank you. As for the water bill, if you will notice, your bill is based on you having just a certain number of people in your household. If you have more people actually living in the home and can prove it you can obtain a variance request for increased water allocation from EMWD.

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  26. As for the smell here, when you purchased or rented your home, you never ever visited it or came to see it? If you did, even once, you noticed the smell and should have seen where it was located. You chose to move here, live here and smell that. We did and we live over across from the Oasis.

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  27. Posted on Craigs list:
    "They are proposing a 4 story hotel on Newport and Antelope in Menifee. Does anyone see the problem here? Ah yes, there is nothing to DO here! So who do you think will come to this hotel? Well, true, on holidays we may get some families visiting but what about the OTHER 350 days a year? Parties? Meth labs? Prostitutes or erotic masseuses from Craigs list? Proponents of the hotel project will tell you that we're "anti-development" if we don't want the hotel; that we need the tax dollars. THIS IS PATENTLY UNTRUE! We want development, but we want development that makes SENSE. We have little or no tourism here nor do we want it. Lets put something for the families that LIVE here, not for the transients that will come here "in between holidays" if we build a massive hotel. We can get tax dollars just as easily from a gym, a movie theater, a book store, or some nice restaurants without trying to make Menifee something it ISN'T. "
    Thanks "Mrs Nimby" for lighting a fire under me, it is NOW my personal mission to squash this project. Have a nice day!

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  28. Working Mommy is entitled to her ideas, even if they are moderately incorrect. It is clear that you have no experience in the hotel or travel industry, having worked during college in the hotel industry - I do.

    A nice hotel will attract nice people, thats why I stay at Holiday Inn and Quality Suites and not Motel 6 and Super 8. Go check out the new La Quinta in Temecula, there are not meth labs or parties in there, just families traveling on vacations, business people staying a night and relatives of local residents.

    The REALITY is that we do have tourism in our golf courses, local lakes, college, senior community, large non-profit events at the college. All of these bring people to town that need a nice place to stay. There is a need for a quality hotel in Menifee, and yes I live in a tract near the area of the hotel and travel Newport every day.

    My guess is the developer will have to pay to widen the streets and that would be a godsend. Wouldn't you rather have your Mom stay at a nice hotel here in Menifee as opposed to the Super 8 on McCall or having to drive all the way to Temecula?

    Good Day,

    Mrs NIMBY

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  29. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  30. What I know is this: that hotels have a high fixed costs of operating. So again I pose the question? What about the other 350 days out of the year when there is not a holiday? How is the hotel going to cover these costs? I hardly call one golf course a "tourist attraction" btw. And which lakes are you talking about? Menifee lakes or Heritage Lake? It wouldn't make any sense for someone to stay in Menifee off of the 215 to go to Lake Elsinore off the 15. Diamond lake is the only lake that might attract tourists. The crux of the matter is this: most people I know who moved here don't want to live in a touristy town, if they did they would've moved somewhere else. I think people are so flattered with the idea that we are "big city" or "upscale" enough for a big hotel they are creating an industry/need where one perhaps MARGINALLY exists. Let's not get too big for our britches. As for comparisons to Temecula, they have a multimillion dollar gaming and wine industry. We DON'T and I am glad, quite frankly. My husband sees enough activity at SW Detention center, where he works, to know that Temecula's tourism is hardly benign; anyone lost someone dear due to DUI? Ask anyone involved with Pechanga about the closing of Silk and the Eagle's Nest about the hotel industry..oh not a fair comparison? Perhaps we shouldn't compare apples to oranges then. As for MY experience, I think an MBA and a BA in sociology gives me sufficient experience. In closing I say this: Do we want to beg for spring break tourism like Palm Springs recently did despite effectively shutting it down a decade and a half ago, of do we want to be self-sufficient on our own dollars maintaining the good quality of life we currently enjoy?

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  31. Oh btw, Mrs "Not In My BackYard", do you have a real name?? Are you even a misses? Are you a real citizen or a "plant"?

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  32. I think this hotel deal must be lining someones pockets since they have a really oddly pro-hotel "plant" posting on these boards.

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  33. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  34. Don't repost copyrighted material from other sources please. Use only specific quotes, and then write your own comments.

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  35. And don't just copy and paste full pages from other sites as comments. Say something of your own.

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  36. Are we against informing the public Steve??

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  37. Newspapers and other websites have already informed the public. There's no need to repost it again.

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  38. They were properly attributed to their sources. But next time I'll post the hyperlink instead.

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  39. Attribution is not the point. Blog comments are meant for you to say something of your own, and not repost someone else's full length articles or webpages.

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  40. Is Mrs NIMBY really Darci Kuenzi, an elected official?? An exerpt from her election website:

    "Her career has revolved around business. From training and development in the hospitality industry to owning her own small business as a consultant and certified tax preparer, to CEO of the Menifee Valley Chamber of Commerce to her current position with Supervisor Ashley."
    I found Mrs NIMBY's sarcasm to be quite biting. It would be extreme conduct unbecoming for an elected official to use anonymous blog postings to further an agenda...What do you think??

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  41. I am not a 'plant', unless you consider my garden -- I guess id be some spicy oregano then!

    :)

    I am a local resident of more than 10 years, I live off of Newport Road and Menifee Road. My guess is your new to town. Obviously you have not been around Menifee much, there is more than one golf course. Yes Diamond Lake is a tourist attraction and Newport road is the main drag to the marina. It is also a main drag to Lake Elsinore, making it an important roadway in our valley. I know Id rather stay in Menifee at a hotel that Hemet any day if I was going to the lake.

    I am certainly NOT Mrs Kuenzi and there is no money lining my pocket, I just would like to see Menifee step it up in class and not be a one horse hick town full of people that say silly things like 'too big for britches'. There are wonderful towns in places like Oklahoma where no one will bother you, there are no hotels and people wear 'britches' all day long!

    I moved my family here to have a nice house in a nice growing community. Sorry girl, but a 70 room upscale hotel is not going to turn Menifee into a ghetto, barrio or a white trash trailer park. It will provide a service to our community that is needed, tax dollars our city needs and decent jobs that we REALLY NEED.

    Good Day,

    Mrs MIMBY

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  42. hahaha so you've resorted to personal attacks now, not in my backyard? i've been here since 89 fyi and the name of the other golf course is?? Am I a girl a newbie or a hick, which is it DK? For the record, I'm not new, not a hick, highly educated, and well read hence my familiarity with colloquialisms such as "too big for their britches" (from the Little House series). And if you are not an elected official, spicy oregano, who are you? I'll be glad to take this dialogue further at the next council meeting. See you there!

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  43. on second thought, I think NIMBY just insulted all of us who moved here for what this town is already. perhaps instead of me moving to OK she belongs in OC!

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  44. With what I have been reading regarding the council we obviously, being a new city, just chose anyone for a council memeber. We really need to, as Menifeein's, be kept much more informed and have much more of a say. We elected these people, they work for us, they are our employees. Not addressing traffic 9issues, possibly giving consessions to commercial and residential developers, is not in Menifee's best interest and THAT is what should matter. There are so many existing areas that needs to be addressed and it seems they have been put aside. We dont need hotels, and commercial should slow as well since we have the Menifee Market Place that needs to get to 100% occupancy. Menifee doesn't need additional empty store fronts. Get a GRIP Council!

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  45. Wow, some one really dislikes Darcy Knuezi. I am SURE Mrs Knuezi has far better things to do than argue with you about a hotel on this blog. Plainly you have issues with women who are assertive, sorry if I don't just lay down and let you say a bunch of stuff that only represents a few people. Plenty of people in my neighborhood look forward to smart development that helps to build a glorious city.

    Again, I am NOT her (Knuezi), my name is Marie, I live in Menifee and the name of the other TWO courses are North Golf Course and California Golf and Art (aka Cherry Hills). No, there is not a chance of me leaving my last name or street location for fear of you.

    And again - no, I am not moving to OC, I am staying here in beautiful Menifee. This will be my last post on this topic unless someone else wants to have an intellectual conversation about reality. I pray that the hotel is successful and the patrons are blessed. My prayers even extend to you Working Mommy, I pray you see a grander picture and not just your own self interests.

    Good Day,

    Mrs. NIMBY

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  46. well sorry "marie" (sure) it looks like you are the only one on this blog supporting the hotel. Thanks anon 3:16 for summing it up nicely. And I have nothing against assertive women or Darcy Kuenzi other than I think you are her based on several of your statements, but Marie I don't find you assertive at all but snarky, sarcastic, and condescending. the only fear you should have is not of me but what will happen if you get your wish. I'd say GOD bless, but perhaps that would be too hick of me....

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  47. Just an FYI,
    There is no room to widen any roads on Newport and Antelope.That is not the only traffic problem area anyway. It's a serious problem from Menifee Rd. all the way to Murietta Rd. I also did not see any plans to do so by the developer.

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  48. I remember as a kid growing up on the central coast there really wasn’t a lot of things to do. We would fill our summer vacations with nothing but trouble (vandalism, smoking, loitering, etc.) then they built a movie theater and most of the time it gave us a place to hang out and stay out of trouble.

    Why have we not talked about that? I feel a nice new movie theater would be a great addition to this great city.

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  49. I would love a theater! Hate driving to Murrieta or Temecula to see a movie. My husband came up with a great idea for the old Target: a bowling alley and roller rink! I would love for my son to have the simple pleasures I enjoyed as a kid. Instead of changing the character why can't we enhance it? Big fancy hotels don't make great communities...Great post anon 9:24!

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  50. A movie theater is a wonderful way to add to our community. Not to mention it would bring in a lot of revenue. How about right across from the new target center. And add in several restaurants. It would give people a chance to go out and do dinner and a movie on a weekday and not have to worry about the traffic getting to and coming from Temecula.

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  51. Can anyone find a reason not to add a theater to the area? It would give the kids a common place to got and be kids.

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  52. I love fancy hotels. Bowling alleys are great too. Theaters are nice as well. This lady must really hate hotels, hope she never has to stay in one on a vacation or a road trip. What we need is a hotel with a theater and a bowling alley! Oh wait, that would be a tourist attraction and that would be bad.

    Still, I like bowling alleys, theaters and hotels all the same. Who else enjoys these types of establishments? Have any of you stayed at a hotel, then bowled and later seen a movie after you ate at a sit down restaurant? I have, and it was quite the good time!!

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  54. Wow you all are acting like a bunch of mean third graders! It sounds like this poor lady is really upset about what's going on in her neighborhood and instead of Christian-like compassion all I see is hatefulness. You all should be ashamed of yourselves. I like hotels but maybe they should put it in a business area and not in someone's neighborhood?

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  55. FYI there used to be a bowling alley on Mcall. It closed down because there was nothing but drug dealing in there going on. I lived here since 89 & probably went in there 2 or 3 times & did not like it at all. So bowling alley bad idea. As far as the hotel going in, I don't care just as long as they do something about traffic first, build another bridge because waiting 15 minutes to get on the onramp freeway is riducules. Oh yea NO MORE HOUSES either, there are alot of empty ones out there already.

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  56. Hopefully future vistors don't read this blog or they won't want to stay here! These girls are cattier than the Real Housewives!

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  57. The traffic is really bad. Is there a plan to widen the Newport overpass like they did on Los Alamos? Also we need more restaurants before a hotel and YES no more HOUSES PLEASE

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  58. The problem is we have a bunch of republicans on our council. We finally got rid of Bush only to be stuck with these guys. No doubt they will run this city into the ground just like Bush did to our country.

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  59. So are they planning on widening the 215 before or after this hotel is built?

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  60. Poor Mommy....she still believes in a government for the people. :( she doesn't know that what is going on in this city is part of a master plan and its bigger than any of us. Big business rules here.

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  61. Hopefully we can get q break on our propert taxes. For what I pay monthly I could've gotten a house in Temecula instead.

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  62. Another commented was deleted above due to name calling, another no-no on this blog.

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  63. you might want to check out your whisical posters. lots of profanity. unless u have a problem with just me.

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  64. Can we get a true name for "working mommy"?

    I want to make sure I stear clear of her; she frightens me.

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  65. hahaha good it's Jenn Lyon. I am not afraid of you anon

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  66. To the blogger on 5/13/09 at 3:12,

    I am a Democrat and attend many council meetings. Have you? The council members that we have are top of the line and I agree with many of their philosophies regarding local issues. I probably would disagree on their positions of state and federal issues. However, partisan politics does not or should play a role on a local level. Thus far, I am very proud of this City Council. They are doing a great job thus far.

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  67. I'm sure she wears a name tag around town. Lame.

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  68. You call out working mommy but hide behind anonymous? since when is someone with an opinion scary? lynn w.

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  69. You call out working mommy but hide behind anonymous? since when is someone with an opinion scary? lynn w.

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  70. Great job Perris Station for that killer bust at the Sun City Super 8! The whole trunk of the police cruiser was covered with alcohol! woohoo can I have a hotel on my corner? pretty please??? JJL

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  71. As a law enforcement officer and Menifee resident I agree 100% with Working Mommy's view on the hotel project. Hotels tend to be a hotbed of criminal activity for all the reasons she states. I don't understand the animosity towards her since it's clear she has the safety of our community in mind. I hardly consider he views to be born of as self-interested. There should be more citizens out there who are public safety minded, it makes my job that much easier. (Due to the sensitive nature of my occupation, I am posting anonymously.) Deputy C

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  72. THANK YOU DEPUTY C! That is exactly it. I really don't get the hatred either....It's mind boggling really

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  73. This is too much.

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  74. FYI, that is the Menifee Super 8, sun city is not a city, Menifee is.

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  75. More Pettiness...almost as bad as the Craigslist drama. Ok "FYI" Menifee Super 8.

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  76. "Still, I like bowling alleys, theaters and hotels all the same. Who else enjoys these types of establishments? Have any of you stayed at a hotel, then bowled and later seen a movie after you ate at a sit down restaurant? I have, and it was quite the good time!!"

    Reality-check, who has actually done that??? Sounds like someones trying the art of persuasion like her PR consulting firm promotes...

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  77. we were in arizona and the hotel we stayed at was near a theater and a bowling alley, we bowled during the day, ate dinner and went to a movie, nothing complex about it. heck, it was even fun. in fact the same trip we even went to a family fun center! that was fun as well! scottsdale is a nice city, i only hope that menifee can be that nice some day.

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  78. O.K. let’s put all our differences aside that would rather have a movie theater instead of a hotel. I think the theater would serve a larger part of our community. It seems as if a hotel would only help a small amount of people.

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  79. Has anyone been to the Incredilbe Johns Pizza Place over in Mo Val. The place is awesome ..... except for the location. I really think a place like that would be excellent for Menifee. Any idea on how we could possible make taht happen????

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  80. This going back and forth between people on this topic is crazy. The point is that put a hotel across from the shopping center (not that we really need another "employer" that pays minimum wage), build an overpass on Newport and 215, stop building more new houses so "demand" will help homeowners see their house values rise again, more nice places to eat, and really help try to keep the elements out of Menifee. I live by the lakes and have had problems on my block with three differnt gang members. Let us keep the house values up to hopefully keep the gang members out of Menifee. Also, whoever posted about voting in the right people, now we know what to look for in the future people running for office. We will vote right the next time.

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  81. This is why voting by district is so important. We need representatives sensitive to the concerns of affected neighborhoods. I agree that they need to widen the overpass regardless of what they put on that corner.

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  82. Dear Readers,

    No...we do not need to widen the overpass at Newport Road just yet. However, when we do... I will push to have the construction done at night (the graveyard shift) so that it does not disrupt commerce in the city and all of us getting back and forth across town.

    We need to take the center median out between Menifee and Antelope Roads and add a lane on each side of the street. To do this, we need to work with the residents in the neighborhoods that are effected to make this happen. Believe me, widening this road will help and 'dialing in' the timing of these signals across the freeway at Newport will help. Please understand that we are at the mercy of CalTrans on traffic light timing.

    We also need to build the Holland Road Overpass BEFORE both Scott Road and Newport Road overpass widening projects begin as part of the I-215 Corridor widening projects. I don't know if this can be done logistically and from a timing standpoint but, if we at least get it done before Newport gets widened...that will help.

    The I-215 widening project consists of three phases: I-215 South Phase (I-15 / I-215 split to Scott Road), the I-215 Central Phase (Scott Road north to Perris) and I-215 North Phase (Perris north to CA-60).

    Folks, we need another east-west arterial to improve traffic flow in the city to alleviate much of the congestion that you are all speaking of. Recall the grass fire two weeks ago southeast of town that caused Scott Road to close for about 1 1/2 hours.... look what that did to Newport and Scott Roads during the afternoon commute(without additional commercial development).

    We need another east / west route without a doubt!

    While we're on the subject, we also need to complete the Menifee Road connection north to Simpson Road thereby creating a north-south route on the east side of town. Think about it... we have two north / south routes on the west side of town: Bradley and Murrieta Roads. On the east side you have, Antelope Road (sort of) and then Menifee Road which stops by Freedom Crest Elementary. East of that the only north / south route (without a 4-wheel drive) is Ca-79.

    I'm sure you not aware so I'll tell you... both the Holland Road Overpass and the completion of Menifee Road are in the City's "Captial Improvement Plan" or CIP. This CIP outlines the cities major projects for the next five fiscal years. Keep in mind that all of this takes $$$$$ and we're working on funding sources, including conditioning developer projects to fund some of this stuff.

    Remember too that it will take just over $4 million to finish the Newport Road Re-Alignment and that work is going out to bid with construction scheduled to begin this summer.

    So, shoot me an e-mail at smann@cityofmenifee.us if you have questions, comments or would like clarification of commercial development in the city, or for any project in the city for that matter. You can also reach the other councilmembers and their e-mail addresses which are listed at the city's website: www.cityofmenifee.us.

    These are just my views and not necessarily the views of the other four councilmembers.

    Thanks for listening,

    Scott A. Mann
    Councilmember

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  83. Scott,
    Thanks for taking the time to share. It's helpful to see the BIG picture here. Opening up Menifee to Simpson would be huge for my neighborhood as our elementary school kids attend Freedom Crest yet we are cut off by Menifee Lakes and Oasis so we must use Antelope and Newport to get there during the worst traffic times I might add. I totally agree with removing the median-it drives me nuts how much room it takes up and shortens the left turn lanes for NB Antelope. We look forward to more posts from our council members on the progress of these important projects! Thanks Scott!!!

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  84. Let's take out the median so we have more concrete and less greenery. Sounds like a great idea.

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  86. Obviously, Mann doesn't come anywhere close to Newport, Antelope Road and 215 turnoff because he sure in the heck wouldn't want to put Hollands road improvements first. His suggestions for the first and second improvements must be close to where he lives. I swear, this Mann is starting to scare me, with his changing curfew for all kids just because his kid is out running around, also his big deal in the beginning to have the councilmen get "credit cards" for themselves (which was voted down), and his hand in the developers pockets. All is wants to do is please them, not the citizens of Menifee. I would say when voting comes around again, just go back and read the meetings notes and see what HE fights for.

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  87. Part of the issue has to do with the i215 Corridor plan which impacts more than just Menifee. I may be mistaken but I believe we are also receiving funds from the county which would lead me to deduce that there will be somethings beyond anyone's control. A Holland O/P would ease congestion by offering an alternate to Scott and Newport. The left turn from NB Antelope to WB Newport certainly adds to the congestion problem for those crossing Antelope. Another onramp to the 215S from WB Newport, from the right lane would also help, freeing the left turn lane for those headed to the Menifee Marketplace. I'm sure everyone has ideas on this but even UPS has its drivers avoid left turns. As for Councilman Mann, I think it goes without saying that when trying to come up with practical solutions, there is nothing nefarious in looking to one's own experiences. A lot of kids are involved in extracurricular activities and 11pm gives them more leeway. The last thing we want to do is be overly restrictive. If the rest of the communities have 11pm curfews we should as well.

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  88. Holland overpass and Menifee/Simpson connector sound great hopefully we don't have to wait 5 years for that to happen.
    Does anyone know...
    Whats going in the old Target?
    Is BJ's still coming to Menifee in 2010? Is TGIF's coming to Menifee? When is Menifee Breakfast Club and Hana Sushi opening? Is LA Fitness/24hr coming to Menifee? Who has the answers to these burning questions?

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  89. I agree with Terry Freeman comments on the Dairy/RV Park. I live in Menifee Greens community(behind the fire station) and the smell is awful. There are times when breathing the air is unbearable. There have been times when my eyes were burning/watering. Not sure if is the Dairy or the RV Park but something has to be done. The quality of life in this area of our community is decreasing. I can only hope that this weekend of outside activities are not interrupted by the intrusive oder!
    Neighborhood Watch Program

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  90. I don't understand why people complain about the dairy/rv park. They have been there forever. Yes I know it STINKS but did you not notice them when looking for a house on that side?? When I was looking for a house, I knew to keep away from that area. Just leave the dairy/rv park alone, its not there fault that homes were built so close to them. I like the rv park, I've camped there before.

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  91. Anonymous, at May 15, 2009 1:21 PM

    Did you read Mr. Mann's post? He clearly illustrated his ideas to deal with traffic including the Antelope/Newport intersection. A Holland overpass will help alleviate both Scott Rd and Newport intersections with Antelope.

    I wish you and Working Mommy would stop talking as if you represented everyone. I too believe that a nice hotel is a huge win for our city. I know the golf courses (Menifee Lakes, The North, and The CA Art & Country Club) will welcome them. Weddings and events will be easier to book with local lodging.

    Thanks to Mr. Mann for taking time to give us some good information. Unfortunately, many fearful and skeptical people are very leery of change. Fortunately, I believe they are only few (but loud).

    NIMBY, you are too much. Thanks for standing up to the conspiracy theorists out there. Many of us, like you, feel the same way but do not take the time to chime in.

    Mann, Kuenzi, NIMBY Marie: 95% of us never post on this site or go to City Council meetings. We support your efforts, trust your motives, and know that you're doing you best for our young city.

    Now look out while I get blasted for not revealing my true identity OR accused of being a developer OR a Council member that's "on the take" OR unChristianlike OR simply stupid OR ______________ .

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  92. While I think we need to consider carefully where a hotel is placed, we sorely need one. I for one have family visiting several times a year, and they have to go to Murrieta or Temecula to find a decent hotel that is not druggie infested. If it is a higher class hotel with higher rates, that alone will keep the low lifes out.

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